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Posted by: Rum Dust N Ruckus Nov 18 2007, 07:14 PM

Thought id do a write up on setting your 4x4 up for offroading and doing some trip's.

When I talk about offroading, I like to do trips, from simple touring along marked dirt roads, to fire trails (some of where 4x4 is not even required) right through to rock crawling and the serious stuff...

In Part 1 we will start with the basics, why you need them, and how to get the most from them.

Firstly, there are a few differant classes of 4wd's, and what I class as a 4wd (this point always starts a few pub arguments)

A 4WD should have:
Solid Axle's or at least a Solid Rear (Wheel Travel and load carrying)
A seperate Chassis from the Body (strength)
LOW RANGE 4x4 is a MUST!!
A Reasonable amount of Ground Clearance

Anything that does not have these I will describe as an All Wheel Drive (Subaru's, CRV's Etc)

Once you have selected the 4wd that suits you the best the time comes to modify it, and beleive me you can get seriosly carried away!
I beleive that there are some essentials and some would be nice's. So here we go with some mods and why they are important.

BULL BAR These are nessacary as we all know Australia's outback is full of all sorts of critters and having some up front protection for your car, radiator and engine components. It also provides a mounting point for some of our other additions later. I would reccomend a good steel Bullbar in most cases, such as that made By ARB.

Spotlights If Any of the critters we have the bullbar to protect us from are out there, Its best we see them as early as possable. Driving lights have come a long way recently. One of the new additions is the range of HID (High intensity Discharge) Lights which have an extremly high output for less power (similar to the Xenon lights seen in some expensive european cars)

UHF Radio The main reason for having a UHF is for car to car contact if there is more than 1 on the trip. However in some cases it may be your only option to call for help in an emergency if your mobile is out of range. Mount a good arial to your bullbar and buy a decent UHF such as ICOM, GME or uniden.

Tyres If your heading off the beaten track it can be wise to upgrade your tyres. Some H/T tyres are not suitable for travelling on alot of dirt. I would reccomend a A/T or a M/T tyre with a square edge as these are less prone to staking by rocks or sticks. (BFG, Mickey Thompson are two of my Fav's)

Dual Batteries If your spending some time in the bush, Dual batteries provide you with extra power for running fridges, accessories, Cd Players etc while your not running, and still ensuring you have power to start in the morning. Also a topic of argument is how to set them up, and from my experiance the best and simplest method os to run a Deep Cycle as your second battery, Have all accessories (lights, radios, Outlets etc etc etc) connected to this battery. That way when you leave the lights of the radio on with the fridge and you flatten the deep cycle, your main battery is diconnected from the system, so when you turn the key to start, the main battery has all the power to crank the engine.. The systems can be bought complete or as a solinoid that you do yourself. I beleive "red arc" make a great simple system. It works on a solinoid that when 13.4 volts is reached in the main battery the solinod will open and start charging your second battery.. Once the main battery drop below 13.4 volts the solonoid disconnects, saving you main battry for starting. The only Thing that I would connect to your main battery with the starter motor is a winch if you run one, as it is only used when the motor is running and requires as much power as possable. This is also a good time to run some accessory outlets around the car. I Have a Cigarette and a Hella Type output mounted inside the cab and on both side of the tray giving me access to power in all places for fridge's air compressors lights etc.. In a wagon i would have them in the front and on each side in the rear.

Diff Breather All cars have diff breathers as standard, however they are mounted down on the diffs where they will suck in water the first time you go into some water. Some Hose (forget its name but like a clear fuel hose) can extend the breather hight into the bonnet or rear of the car. Also extend your g'box and transfer case breathers.

Always Carry a First aid kit, Fire extinguisher and supply of fresh water

I Think as a start this will do. If you have any questions please ask, Or if you think I have missed anything then Please add it to the list for disscusion.

Next time We will go into more mods, Such as Suspension Upgrades and gear for getting into the rough stuff.

Posted by: poly Nov 18 2007, 09:47 PM

rum if i may say one thing here, i don't like the idea of fridges and lights running off the batteries as it has been my experience that a lot of peeps don't know when to turn them off hence flattening there batteries, your idea of twins may help but when i come across some of the city people who have bought a 4x4 and think they know it all are the ones that end up needing help.
all my lights are gas and the fridge is gas electric.
love those Micky Thompsons
this is a very good read RUM keep it up mate

Posted by: Rum Dust N Ruckus Nov 18 2007, 10:17 PM

The system I use for the dual batteries poly has all accessories connected to the second battery. That way the second battery can go flat because it becomes desconnected from the main battery as soon as the main is at 13.4 volts which is pleanty in a cranking battery to start the engine.

As long as the system is wired correctly you cannot flatten the main battery...

As a backup my system uses a override button, whick allows you to link the batteries manually to start of both batteries, should the main battery become flat.

I have drawn a quick diagram to explain the setup...

I should add, that for things like Aux outlets, trailer brakes and items that draw high current i prefer to use circuit breakers than fuses.

Posted by: poly Nov 19 2007, 10:51 PM

thanks for that rum, people like u who set there 4x4s up wright very seldom get serious trouble and if they do they will most likely be able to get out of it.
i said in an earlier post that it was city people that don't think about or plan for a trip in the bush and when they get there do some very dumm things like the peep we came across some years ago camped in a very remote area, he had left the lights on all night because his wife was afraid of spiders, he had been stuck there for 2 days when we came along at least they had stayed with the 4b.
after getting there 4b started we sat down to a cup of tea and a yarn to cut a long story short it turned out that this was there fist trip off road they had not told any one were they were going just that it was a camping trip for 2 weeks.
we got to know them well as we let them tag along with us for the next 4 days as that was the duration of owe trip last we herd from them was they had joined a 4 wheel drive club.

Posted by: Rum Dust N Ruckus Nov 19 2007, 11:09 PM

too right poly, too many people dont realise the dangers of the outback or what you need.. Hopefully i can cover a few things in this thread that might give some who havnt one it before an Idea, however I would always reccomend that you do a TAG along or travel with someone who has done that type of trip before if you are inexperianced.

Posted by: SUMOFISHIN Nov 20 2007, 12:23 AM

Poly and Rum, if you want to do it correctly and never have any problems do not use an alternator splitting system as it will not charge evenly if batteries have dissimilar voltages, the most effective way is to use a continuous duty solenoid which connects the batteries in parallel while ever the ignition is switched on, this way the voltage will equalize and the alternator will charge both evenly not shut down once one battery reaches correct voltage.
when you use an alternator splitting system the regulator will shut down then any one battery reaches 13.6volts , therefore the other battery may only be half charged. Hope this hasn't confused you .

Posted by: Rum Dust N Ruckus Nov 20 2007, 12:45 AM

My system always keeps the MAIN battery above 13.6 volts sumo,

The second battery being a DEEP CYCLE will not be harmed by being only half charged. The AUX battery is just that... If it does go flayt then your beers get warm and you might lose some food..... But your car will still start..

The system charges JUst the main battery untill it is 13.4 and then charges Both batteries..

The one problem with your system sumo, is that If you aux is flat and you connect and do not get enough charge into both batteries, you may find that over time both batteries wil be to low to start the car.. My system ensures that the main battery is always full.. I know this because in 2 of my early cars it was the system that i used and i had that exact problem. My solinoid was linked to IGN (also had a switch that could bypass) and I flattened both batteries by sucking the second one dry.

THERE IS HOWEVER A SOLUTION TO YOUR IDEA THOUGH, I know this because in 2 of my early cars it was the system that i used and i had that exact problem. My solinoid was linked to IGN (also had a switch that could bypass) and therefoer i could manually control the charge into the batteries via the switch. This however means if you forget it you could be stuck. And make my system easy because you can forget about it as it does the switching fr you.

There are other issues with having one alternator charging 2 types of batteries with differant capacities, but lets not go into that. (rotronics isolaters solve this issue but are VERY Expensive)

This is the system that I have installed in many touring cars in my time working for ARB and as a 4wd Mechanic and is by far the best system... Although individual needs change and if it doesnt suit you thats ok, but its my favoured system.

There is however one know issue with my system, and that is more so if you dont use the veichle (or boat) often and the main battery starts to lose its edge. The "Smart" type solinoids will open the circuit when the main charges back up but the initial voltage drop of connecting the deep cycle will drop it below 13.4 again and the solonoid can get stuck in a viscious open/close/open/close state, which will quickly destroy the solinoid..

Posted by: Smelly Nov 20 2007, 03:09 AM

Hey Rum ,

some great info in there .

I wanna put a dual batt setup in the Paj .

so i think your post might help me out , thanx

who sells these red arc kits & how much moolah ??



& POLY you mentioning the fridge reminded me of seeing some 4b in the back of a 4wd mag burnt to the ground under a tree which was also burnt.

can't remember the details exactly....

They ran outta fuel for their boat & were filling it's tank at the back of the 4b , which was parked under the shade of a big'ol tree .

Well the fridge kicked in & set the whole shebang alight .

I do remember something bout a pilot light on the fridge being an old fridge ???

Posted by: Rum Dust N Ruckus Nov 20 2007, 03:49 AM

smelly, Red arc's are around $200 normally but can be founfd on ebay for $110..

I Keep my own rolls of 3mm, 4mm, 3mm twin, 4mm twin, 6mm and 6mm twin as i do alot of instalations of gear for people still..

You would only need to buy enough for what you need though... 4 Aux plugs run 6mm Twin Core and for batterys I run Heavy battery cable with soldered on ends using a heat gun.

As for fridges, personally dont like Gas ones, they work great on Gas but are useless on 12v.. I have had no problems with my marine deep cycle running a fridge and lights etc for a few days (engel fridge)

As Sumo has said there are cheaper ways to do this with a standard soilnoid wiered uo to Ignition (aroud $50) but I like the idea of the main battery being looked after! There are also more complicated systems that look after charging rates of differant batteries (acid cell compared to deep cycle) but they are much more expensive (Ro Tronics)

I can say that All ARB, TJM, Red Arc etc kits that are installed around the country will work for 99.9% of people with no problems and have installed over 100 sets with no problems and would reccomend it to anyone who wants a dual battery system that looks after itself.


Just want to add, I incorrectly stated earlier that the RED ARC connects both batterries at 13.4 volts....

The correct figures are that the aux is brought into the charging circuit at 13.2 volts, and when the main drops to 12.5 volts the Aux is disconected to recharge the main.

Check out http://www.redarc.com.au/smartstart-techspec.pdf for more info on the red arc

Posted by: Fed Nov 20 2007, 10:21 AM

I'd rather be in control with one of those (1, 2, BOTH, OFF) manual switches.

Posted by: SUMOFISHIN Nov 20 2007, 01:38 PM

Rum, Isolators are ok if you buy the smart charge system but as you say they are in excess of $200 dollars , on the other hand a continuous duty solenoid has been around a lot longer and is more effective, in my career as an Auto Electrician I have seen Many stuck and melted solenoids ,BUT never in my life have I seen a continuous duty solenoid with a problem, they cost less than $60 and guarantee the equalisation of battery voltage. if connected correctly you can connect it through a switch in series with ignition, you can even have a switch to activate solenoid for jump starting engine off auxilary battery if required. you mention deep cycle battery for auxilary, deep cycle batteries are known as Calcium/Calcium batteries and most high grade motor vehicle batteries are now Calcium/Calcium so even though you may have two different capacity batteries it is wise to use a Calcium/Calcium for your starting battery.

as Fed states, the manual changeover switch is an option, if you remember to switch it, but electronics fail miserably, and that is why I always use cont. duty solenoids. they do not rely on electronic microchips to operate.

Posted by: poly Nov 22 2007, 12:36 AM

hmmm numb nuts at work again, and i don't mean u by that fed

fed if its a gas fridge it has to have a polite light so why would u try to fuel up any thing with in a bulls raw of it.

Posted by: Smelly Nov 23 2007, 05:05 AM

Thanx Chadd & SUMO for that matter , it's good to hear a few diff opinions .

I'll look into it , it'd be good to have it by chrissy .

Can picture it now kick'n back by the river with the doof doof crankin . :whistling:

Posted by: jasonb Mar 17 2008, 01:59 AM

hey rummy what happened to part 2 ,,,hahahaha

Posted by: Rum Dust N Ruckus Mar 17 2008, 02:18 AM

i havnt been at home drunk and bored yet

Posted by: poly Mar 17 2008, 11:12 PM

well its about time u did young Rum, Now were did i put that slab

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Aug 9 2011, 12:28 AM

Yo Spud
Ute went in yesterday all painted up now
Started the mods yesterday extra 70 odd litres of fuel now, had 90 litres @ one stage that bloody Pez

Yap Yap Yap Yap & more Yap Yap Yap Yaping & he reckons i talk alot
My ears were ringing & i made a booboo new tank was 200 mm's to long & had to cut it down.

If that aint bad enough looks like i have to take him for a fish tommoro so ran to Bunnings & got the biggest ear muffs they had

No probs with clearance now hell i even got Pez under there, wonder if clearance is to high now

Start on the rest of tray when he goes home dont want to make any more mistakes

Posted by: Rumpus Aug 9 2011, 04:17 AM

Haha, oh dear... whats the go wid the motor?

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Aug 9 2011, 04:57 AM

Dee Eee Dee ded

Water getting into 2 of his cylinders, compression is there
Explains spluttering & overheat alarm
Advised not to use it

No more playing Buzuki 4 U

U fluked it , told him not to let you drive it but did he listen to me

Posted by: poly Aug 10 2011, 01:25 AM

photos jumpy, photos lets have a good look at it

Paul

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Aug 10 2011, 04:03 AM

Look @ wot ??????

Only got the car back this morn from panel beaters haven't fitted or finished anything new yet

Posted by: kkw Aug 11 2011, 03:34 PM

Weeping at Weipa this week. Busted a shocky on the corrugations. $500 for a pair of rear old man emus units. Most expensive Woolworths store in Aus. Petrol is $2.54 ltr. My tanks hold 212 lts, so it is an expensive fill. First mobile/internet service for several weeks now. Dual batteries, isolator, fridge etc all working perfectly. Accessory batt goes flat in a day and a half, running the fridge but main battery is full as a boot. Marvels of modern technology - no manual isolator switch required. Queenfish, barra, turrum, squiddlies (I have learnt to pick them up without getting bitten), cast nets etc. All good fun. A 12lb outfit can't hold enough line to stop a decent GT, as i found out.

Posted by: Rumpus Aug 11 2011, 03:36 PM

Comon KKW... i think your trip deserves its own thread and some pics!!!

Posted by: kkw Aug 12 2011, 11:40 PM

It will come when I get time and a stable connection.

Posted by: poly Aug 12 2011, 11:49 PM

why was it in the panel beaters

Paul

Posted by: Fed Aug 13 2011, 02:10 PM

Have you ever seen him drive?

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Aug 14 2011, 04:39 PM

Fed was showing me how to reverse into his driveway & 4got to tell me about this tree

Posted by: Fed Aug 14 2011, 05:02 PM

If you don't have a picture then it didn't happen.

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Aug 15 2011, 03:38 AM

Did take a picture but didn't come out cause of this big shinny blurr

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Sep 10 2011, 12:17 AM

Cant believe how lazy i've been of late
Did pull my finger out last week for a few days & started making thingy's for back of Navara
Started fittings them up today in a very 1/2 hearted way i'm blaming the cold bloody cold today

Should have it all in 2morro as long as it's not cold again then i'll sheet checker plate floor which is allready bent up then it's just the side panels left to do

Posted by: Fed Sep 10 2011, 12:39 PM

Looking good mate where's the dog box going?

Posted by: kkw Sep 15 2011, 12:22 AM

Just returned from 2 months travelling up to the top of Aus. Got bigger tyres than standard, dual batteries, a set of drawers for the rear of the wagon and roof racks. Had a great time and travelled the Old Telegraph Track. No wonder it took 3 weeks to get there in the old days. Creek crossings, one lane track and corrugations. The track was actually smoother to drive on than the 'new' development road. Busted a read Bilstein shock on the way up. No mechanics or spares to fix it in Seisia or Bamaga. Did the OTT with one rear shock. Lucky I also had air bags on the back. It did dance across the road on curves, thanks to the deep and constant corrugations. A few pics.

Posted by: kkw Sep 15 2011, 12:23 AM

And some more. Big pigs up there.

Posted by: Fed Sep 15 2011, 01:02 PM

Sand, mud, heat & 2 fish... I'd rather stick a needle in my eye.

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Sep 15 2011, 02:07 PM

kk did ewe have a big big breakfast day 5th last pic was taken ?

An awefull lot of leanon drivers side of car

Posted by: kkw Sep 15 2011, 02:47 PM

Yeah, but not me driving and not my car. Always pays to walk the creek yourself instead of listening to others advice. The water was muddied from a previous car and they told Mark the best track was to keep one wheel on the hard rock. I went through after this pic and just kept in the water. Was only up to the top of the bumper and flat. I actually lost weight on the trip. Almost as slim as you now. Almost, I said......

Posted by: poly Sep 17 2011, 01:54 AM

kk did you take a bang stick along to help catch some of that pork ??????????????????


Paul

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Sep 17 2011, 03:28 AM

What you on about poly ???

That was kk wearing a black jumper

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Sep 20 2011, 01:23 AM

Finally pulled my finger out & finished it off
Now have an extra 75 litres of fuel tank bigger than what comes standard with car

Thought i'd get the roll bar thingy painted added brackets for up top spotty's & a pair of directional LED's

Posted by: Fed Sep 20 2011, 02:35 PM

Now you'll have to empty your water separator twice a week instead of once a week you goose.

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Sep 21 2011, 12:05 AM

Only bad thing about using alloy

It's nearly as shiny as Fed's Hed

Posted by: Fed Sep 22 2011, 03:00 PM

Look what I found for you Jumpy.
http://www.watermagnet.com/index.html
Condensation my arse!
How often have you emptied your water separator bees?

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Nov 10 2011, 03:05 AM

Ewe're a wally Fed
But ewe allready knew that

Gave Bull Bar making a bit of a twirl turned out ok considering i made it up from off cuts
Goes in the spray booth 2mollo

Posted by: Fed Nov 10 2011, 02:02 PM

But what about the air bags I hope you didn't bridge the crumple zone? HaHaHa! Just kidding mate.
Looking good for an arb clone careful they don't sue you, I hope you're going to paint it a colour other than black.

Well Bees......

Posted by: kkw Nov 10 2011, 02:05 PM

Good effort. If you are getting bored and want to do some alloy work, why not remove the glass deck off my boat and replace the gunwhales and foredeck
This is the last thing you see of my bullbar, if you are a koala, platypus or small furry animal.

Posted by: Jumpus GooDarus Nov 10 2011, 11:29 PM

Rather go ketch me some blekfishy's

Back tray comes off 2mollo going with a jumpus version alloy tray

Posted by: kkw Nov 11 2011, 12:17 AM

Me too. Monday is looking good. Wanna come along.